Hellobee

my brother was on the young side (his birthday is end of october!) but my parents still sent him through and he’s done very well throughout college and in his career now. i really do think it’s a child by child thing!

I don’t have kids yet, but have a close friend whose son’s birthday is mid-July (around now). She agonized a LOT about this debate because felt the ‘mommy-wars’ caving in with judgmental opinions from other moms and worried it would impact his entire school education. Ultimately she did what you said, which is make the decision based on what she thought was best for HIM, and held him back to start after he turned 6. He has been doing really well and she knows it was right decision. On an unrelated note, I started kindergarden when I was 4 (back when cutoffs were Dec 31st and I turned 5 in December) and felt being that young was always best for me.. but I know boys are different and my parents would have made a different decision had I been a different kid. But it’s been interesting to hear all sides of the debate

i’ve never heard of the term red-shirt, so this is really interesting to me. i do agree that it should be done on a case by case basis depending on where a particular child is at.

my daughter has a january birthdate so i don’t think this will be an issue for us, but i know plenty of people who excelled in school despite being on the younger side of their grade.

Mavrick is a July baby so ya, this topic has come up more and more now. I don’t know it didn’t seem something common back when I was younger. I just always thought kids were sent to school unless parents requested they be tested (if they were younger)

I don’t think I’d hold him back. Unless come time to enroll him I feel like he’s not going to do well… but he’s always been the youngest in daycare and loves playing with the older boys. It’s hard to tell just now, seeing that he doesn’t fully talk, but I’m in in about 1 year or so, we will see a huge difference.

I’d definitely wouldn’t do it upon what others think, or what mommy trends are.

oh and I forgot to add, I was the youngest in my group (May birthday) and loved it. As well as being a straight A student, but I know I’m a girl and boys are different. My husband also born in May was not held back and did poorly. But I don’t think him starting early had anything to do with it though.

Here in CT the cutoff is December 31…and our baby is due December 17. People are already asking me if I am going to hold him/her back! I keep saying that I am not going to make a decision until 5 years from now…and certainly not about a child who hasn’t even been born yet! I’m a speech-language pathologist and I work with preschool through 4th grade, so I’m very familiar with the standards and expectations for early elementary school. I figure we’ll just wait and see how our little one does. If I think he/she is ready academically and socially, then I’m all for sending. My husband and I were both among the youngest of our classmates and friends and it was never a problem-we like to think we both turned out fine!

What an interesting post, I was born on 8/21 so I was 4 for the first few weeks of kindergarten, as well. I went to a special Spanish immersion program in a regular public school so I don’t know if that had anything to do with my parents being able to send me “early,” but I didn’t have any problems at all because of it as I got older. The only issue was that I was an excessive talker and wouldn’t come in when the teacher rang the recess bell so she threatened to hold me back and used my age as a reasoning for why she could do that. Psssh, please. I didn’t get held back.

I don’t have kids yet, but my birthday is at the end of July and I wasn’t held back and that was the right thing for me. I’ve always excelled in school and thrived socially when I was a kid, though I’m not sure my parents could have known that then. But in the NYC suburbs, at least 30 years ago, you could attend kindergarten as long as you turned 5 by December 31 so I wasn’t at all the youngest in my class. I don’t think many kids were held back.

@MrsSunglasses: I too don’t recall this being a big issue until within the past maybe 10-15 years when I think some parents started doing it to give their kids (boys particularly) a leg-up, so to speak, in sports (at least that is what happened in the area of the US where I’m located).

I have thought about this issue since I am due in mid-September and we are team green. DD was born in April so it doesn’t impact her. I’m a late December birthday so this wasn’t an issue for my parents. DH’s birthday is 8/29 and while he started kindergarten at age 5 he attended a year of “pre-first” grade before moving onto first grade so I think we will evaluate readiness and make a decision based upon our individual child’s development at the time.

My sister has both a boy (8/1) and a girl (8/7) so this came up with both. She opted to not start her son in kindergarten until he was 6 for reasons related to social development, they also decided to keep my niece back until she is 6 but I think that may just because they kept my nephew back because she seems to be developmentally ready.

I don’t actually have this problem since my child has a winter birthday, although since I work at a school I often feel annoyed he’ll have to wait almost a whole extra year to start here.

A bit like what @purrpletulips mentioned…. here is the way this first-world problem is handled in my neck of the third world….

Rather than preschool and kindergarten, Mexico has three years of kindergarten — K1 (age 3), K2 (age 4) and K3 (age 5). Those children who are not ready to move on to 1st grade after K3 are recommended to participate in an optional year called Pre-First. In my school about a third of the kids go to Pre-First.

I think this is a good solution because it gives kids a chance to DO kindergarten so we don’t have to rely so much on our own instincts.

This has been weighing heavily on my mind since my oldest son was born. His birthday is November 8 th. then I found out about my twins and their birthday is July 30. So since my twins were born I have been thinking about this. If I sent my oldest when he was four I know I would worry about his development. If I held him until he was five he would be in the same grade as his brothers.

LA just changed their dates and it will be September first when we go to put them in school. So now the choice has been made for us. Our three boys will be in the same grade and enter kindergarten when they are all five. I am glad that the difficult decision had now been made for me but I am a little worried about them all being in the same grade. They will constantly have to explain why they are only 8 months apart.

Interesting! My cousin and I have the same birthday (2 years apart) just before Labor day. I went to school at age 4 just about to turn 5. He went at 5 about to turn 6. We both turned out great. You’re right, the decision needs to be made on a case by case basis.

I think as a teacher yourself, lil CB will be fine no matter what. CA’s cutoff is actually Dec 2 (or was). I have a good male friend with a Sept 30 bday that scored an 800 on math on his SAT and went to Harvard. So I agree that it’s definitely a case by case basis.

That picture is so awesome!

DD’s birthday is June, but we’ll probably keep her on track. My mom actually kept me out an extra year (even though my birthday is nowhere near the cut-off), and I always felt much older than my friends/classmates. Not that it’s a bad thing, I just never really clicked with my peers, and I’d like DD to have a different experience. She’s also developmentally on track, so unless something happens in the next couple years, I think she’ll be fine to enter Kindergarten on time.

Interesting! I had no idea this was an issue. I have a late Nov birthday, and I was always one of the youngest in the class (cut off used to be Dec apparently). LO will also have a Nov birthday. so I guess she will now be one of the oldest in her class!

@oceanis723 – wow, that new start date really did decide things for you. Your boys will definitely have an interesting school experience.

I have never heard of someone holding a July or August kid back… ever. I totally understand the November, December kids. My son is a July baby, and I would never think of holding him back.

Like @oceanis723 said, the LA school district is moving up its cutoff date to Sept 1st. I think this is being done so they don’t have to go case by case. The majority of kids will be 5 (school starts mid August).

I myself am an August baby. In retrospect, I think I would have done better in elementary school (socially and academically) if my parents had waited a year to put me in kindergarten. But I did catch up eventually. I would say it depends on the kid. At least now you have the option. When I was kid, it was unheard of.

My baby was born August 8th, he’ll turn one in a couple of weeks (ahhh!). I watched that 60 Minutes piece and this topic is already on my mind. @ Erin– the cutoff date in my state (MA) is Sept. 1st so that’s why its a consideration for late summer babies. If you send them when they just turn 5, they will be the youngest.
We’ll see as time goes on– is anyone considering the competitive sports reasons? So he isn’t the littlest one on the team and has an extra year to mature physically? Of course my husband thinks about this side of the decision (he also watched the 60 Minutes story and that was a big part of the red-shirt craze).

Our little guy is a Dec. 15 birthday and we had to seriously debate this very issue even before he turned 2 in order to determine which preschool group he would be in–either the 2s or the 3s. Initially, we were convinced that he should be with the children younger and be redshirted when he enters pre-school this Sept. But then we changed our minds because he would inevitably be going to the school I teach at, which is a NYC public school, where we will not have a choice to redshirt.

My MIL sent my husband to Primer between kindergarten and first grade, so in a way he was red shirted. Once he went on to first grade he was the oldest in his class. He never loved school, so adding another year on didn’t really do anything for him. I’m not really sure what they do in Primer. It must be a Lousiana or Catholic school thing because I’ve never heard of it anywhere else.

My husband and I were discussing this the other day. Our cutoff is Dec 2, which is actually LO’s birthday. LO seems to be much more advanced that her peers already so we don’t have any concerns about her being the youngest in her class. Plus, I’d rather she be challenged than to be bored. You know what they say about idle hands….

I’m a kindergarten teacher and a tutor, and my Master’s thesis was on academic redshirting, and age of entry at kindergarten. I could write a novel (that you probably wouldn’t want to read!), but loooove to talk about the pros/cons, and all that jazz. If you have any interest in continuing the convo I can DM you. I spoke with a specialist at University of Wisconsin, and she boiled it down to the thinking that kids should be 5 when they start school (although her reasoning was obviously more in depth than that simple statement)! Also, as you well know as a kg teacher, girls generally have an easier time than boys if they are on the young side.

P.s. my cousins adopted an amazing little boy from South Korea, and are leaving soon to bring his little brother home! I find the whole process fascinating! Your little boy is just beautiful:-).

@ladyfingers: i was totally the same way!! i always got in trouble for talking too much…;) and i actually teach in a spanish immersion school. i teach the english portion and teach reading and writing. it’s such an awesome program!

@purrpletulips: @Mrs. Sunglasses: yup, this was totally not the case when i was younger…in fact, i think it was the opposite — parents *wanted* their children to start when they were younger! so fascinating how trends change!

i am really loving all these different comments and points of view! and the different cutoffs by district are so interesting! @Oceanis723: if we lived in your district, we’d have to start the year after because lil’ cb’s birthday is after september 1…but, @Mrs Green Grass: @Red: @mamakwon: if we lived in your districts, lil’ cb’s birthday would be well before the december cutoffs!

and @sloaneandpuffy: so interesting to hear what they do in mexico! did you know that in australia and new zealand, kids start kindergarten on their actual fifth birthday? so, kids just come in at different times of the year and their first day is always their birthday!

@Erin, because the cutoff is september 30, july birthdays are definitely considered for redshirting and boys with august birthdays are very often redshirted. almost 90% of the time in wealthier neighborhoods!

@eve, so interesting! i’d definitely love to hear more! i think you can email me at cowgirl (at) hellobee (dot) com! and congrats to your cousins!!! so exciting!

right now, i think we’re leaning heavily towards sending lil’ CB to kindergarten on time…he’s starting preschool for 3s in september (he will turn 3 during the second week of school) and we’re excited to see how it goes! however, the one arguement i’ve heard that keeps rolling around in my brain is that we have to consider not only the fact that he’ll be four entering kindergarten, but that he’ll be 11 entering middle school and 13 entering high school. *that* concerns me a little, but not enough to sway me, just enough to leave me thinking…

what do you all think about that arguement?

My son is due November 7th and the dirstrict cutoff recently changed to November 1st, so the choice had been made for us. Even if the cutoff was December 1st we would probably still keep him back to be slightly older rather than the youngest. My older brother’s birthday is 11/17 and he was not kept back, which he was unhappy with. I don’t think this whole issue was even discussed in the seventies when he was born. I probably would not hold back a child with a late summer birthday unless there was some specific need to do so.

i actually was planning on writing a post on this very topic because charlie has a dec 10th birthday, and our district cut off is dec 31! i’m not concerned about his emotional maturity though…. he’s already small, and with an end of the year birthday, he will probably always be the smallest or one of the smallest boys in class. i wonder….. how much of that will affect him growing up?

we still don’t plan on holding him back though.

As a former teacher, I’m like you in that I strongly recommend people analyze this on a case-by-case basis. Some kids would be ready and excel at 4, some are barely ready at 6. Personally, I was a June birthday, and I would have been absolutely bored out of my mind if I had been red-shirted. People usually consider if a student is physically and socially ready, which are so important, but sometimes I think people overlook academic readiness, which seems like it would be the most obvious. I’ve definitely seen kids who are not challenged by the learning at their grade level get bored, act out, or just not strive for excellence because there’s no challenge or competition.

I think you’re ahead of the game because (1) you know what to look for, (2) by starting to think about this early, you can evaluate how much he progresses in the next year and have a good idea whether he’ll be able to keep up the pace of kindergarten. Good luck!

fantastic post! I don’t have any children but I’m a teacher and I see kids that still deal with maturity issues in the 5th grade just because they are younger (or older!) than classmates. It really does depend on the kid. Some of my brightest students have also been the youngest. I’m sure that lil’ CB will be just fine : )

Haha he’s so cute! Great post..
I have March and December babies, so I’ll send them “on time” I suppose?

Just curious… why does the “redshirting” dilemma only apply to boys and not girls?

I think earlier cutoff dates were meant to make sure that all student are 5 years old when they start school. The thought that a parent would hold a five year old child back because they will be the youngest is absurd to me. If they are all 5 when they enter, they’re all 5 together. Yes, some will turn 6 before your July or August child will, but that’s always been the case. What’s next, are we ALL going to have our kids in say April, so they are ALL the same age and ALL have some experience being 5 for a few months?

I totally understand a parent evaluating their own child if their district has a later cutoff date, and their child will be four for a couple months while in kinder. But suggesting that a child born after June 30 be held back seems crazy to me.

Why as patents do we have to protect our children from every little circumstance that makes them different from all the other kids? I am not a big fan of making every single kid feel peachy and perfect every single moment of the day. Yes they need support and love and caring, but they don’t need to feel like they are the best or the oldest or the most developed.

Jenny – Redshirting definitely applies to girls too! But Mrs. Cowgirl is blogging about redshirting as it applies to her own family… and she has a son.

As of right now, if my son meets requirements for the state we will live in, he will start on time, which means he is 4 when he starts Kindy (Dec. birthday). If reasons present themselves that make holding him back a year a better option, we’ll consider it then. But, holding him back to give him a better advantage in sports when he’s older, no.

@Jenny, yup @mrbee: is right, i have a boy, so that’s the perspective i was taking. however, the trend is that boys are redshirted waaaay more often than girls. i think that’s because of two major reasons: 1) boys develop later than girls and tend to be more immature during the early school years and 2) (this is the one i find silly) some parents really take into consideration the age and size of their boys and how it will affect them when playing sports growing up. that 60 minutes piece highlights that part a bit and interview’s malcolm gladwell who’s book “outliers” was kind of a tipping point (ha!) in the redshirting trend.

@Erin, i TOTALLY agree. and that’s why we are planning on sending lil’ CB to school on time unless there are glaring issues when he is four. i don’t believe in keeping him back just to give him a leg up and prevent him from being the youngest.

however, as a teacher, i have seen instances where redshirting a child reeeeallly helped because the child was very immature and unable to keep up socially, emotionally, and academically when they were 4 (almost 5) entering kindergarten. one particular child i’m thinking of came back the following year after a year of preschool and lots of work at home and was very successful going forward.

again, at this point, we are set on sending lil’ CB to school on time unless a glaring issue arises, but i do see the other side of the coin in instances of school readiness….as far as just holding any child back because of a late summer birthday? i totally agree with you and think it’s a bit crazy!

My brother and I are pretty much the opp examples of this. I was a semester “behind” in school and he was a semester “ahead” in school because of us coming over from Korea at the ages we did… 5 & 7.

I’d completed a semester of first grade, but since they thought I might need time to perfect the English language, they put me in first grade here, even though I was “age” wise appropriate for second grade.

In terms of schooling, both of us excelled and in hindsight, I don’t know that it would’ve made much of a difference, esp for me. However, social development wise I think I enjoyed being on the older end and love how I developed into an adult and I don’t think it would’ve been the same had I been a grade higher.

This post blew me out of the water. Is starting JK/SK at 4/5 a US thing? I started in JK at 3, and turned 4 on Oct 7th. Cameron won’t be starting until he’s 4 because he has a January birthday and I believe the cut off for turning 4 is Dec sometime… or it was when I was little. I didn’t know you could hold them back at all. I guess it just seems odd to me considering I was pretty close to always being the youngest in my class and it never bugging me.

I don’t know if it’s where I live, but I have only ever known one person who was 4 when they started kindergarten. The cut-off where I live is Sept 1. When I found out she didn’t turn 16 until the beginning of her junior year I thought it was crazy. But from reading the comments here it seems pretty common in other areas. I had no idea other places had cut-offs as late as December!

My son was born in the middle of July, and I always figured I would have him start school when he was six. Mostly because my brother was in the same situation and has done great with being older and definitely doesn’t “seem” older than any of his friends. I have a cousin the same age but he started when he was 5 and has had struggles.

This post made me realize it is best to decide on a case by case basis though, and I will watch my son to see if he is ready at 5 or not.

@CameronsMomma: actually, we don’t have public junior kindergarten here. if you qualify for headstart, your LO can go to public preschool on a sliding scale, but most people have to pay for preschool out of pocket. after reading @Mrs. Sunglasses ‘ post on canadian maternity leave, i’m beginning to think you guys have got it lots better up north!

I know I’m pretty late to this conversation, but couldn’t you just send your kid to school and then, if he’s not doing well or isn’t mature enough or whatever, have him repeat kindergarten? This is exactly what happened with my brother. His birthday was RIGHT at the cut-off, so my parents sent him to school, but after a year, the teachers suggested it might be beneficial for him to repeat it, so that’s what happened. It certainly didn’t bother him any and he thrived in school after that.

@Adira: I remember kids being held back a grade all the time in elementary school but I also remember that there was a stigma and a shame that went with being held back. Other kids would make fun of those kids being held back and call them dumb when in reality, they just weren’t ready to begin with.

Having said that, I’m perfectly ok with starting kids younger. Like I mentioned in my previous post, I’d rather they be challenged by the curriculum than to be bored.

@Adira: in theory, that would work, but i agree with @Red: i’m so glad your brother continued to have a positive school experience and it shows it was the right decision for him. but in most cases, the research shows that it’s not as positive…in fact, i’ve only ever recommended two children for retention in kindergarten because of that. and those two children were actually boys with late august birthdays! they really just needed the extra time to mature in order to be able interact appropriately with their peers and keep up with the curriculum. i’ve definitely had many students were not as mature as the average kindergartner, but those two were glaringly less mature than their peers and we thought they could really use another year…i had many sleepless nights mulling over it because it’s such a tough decision!

Great post! McBebe is due in 2 weeks, and the cutoff here is September 1st, so it’s definitely something we’ll need to think about in a few years.

My niece has an early August birthday, and she started Kindergarten at 4…she’s going into second grade, and so far hasn’t had any issues with being one of the very youngest in her class.

On the flip side, DH is a late August baby, and my MIL did keep him home another year, so he was always one of the very oldest in his class. MIL told me that he was always smart as a whip, but at the time, her and FIL didn’t feel he was emotionally mature enough to go, and they still feel it was the right decision for him (one of his brothers is also an August baby, and they did not keep him home an extra year).

So we’ve just decided to wait and see, lol.

@Red: @Mrs. Cowgirl: Interesting! There was definitely a stigma in school about staying back, but I only really experienced that for older students. Kids in kindergarten didn’t really notice or care when a former classmate wasn’t in their class the next year. Plus at our school, kindergarten was only half-day, so kids were in the am or pm sessions and not everyone knew everyone. Once you went to first grade, there were kids that were left behind, but so many new ones to meet, that you didn’t really notice.