Bee and I have been worried about Charlie becoming spoiled and entitled, especially as he’s started to whine and throw tantrums more (not sure which one is worse). It is embarrassing showing this video, but here is Charlie whining for ice cream.
So we’ve been reading up on how to say “no” to your kids. We’ve read a few books and Googled the blogosphere, but actually the best tips for saying “no” have come from Hellobee!
We’ve been trying three types of n’os out on Charlie, and thought we’d share the results with you:
- “Tina’s No” aka the Explanatory No
- “The Hide & Seek No” aka the When/Then No.
- The French No
1. Tina’s No
Hellobee’s Tina posted to the boards about how acknowledging your toddler’s emotions can help prevent and resolve tantrums (she mentioned her approach was “a modified version of the “Happiest Toddler on the Block” toddler-ese and fast-food-rule strategies.”).
We wanted [our son RJ] to put on his shirt and he didn’t want to. When we offered him a choice between two shirts, he pushed them both away and wailed — he didn’t care which shirt, he just didn’t want a shirt. When we challenged him to put the shirt on by himself, he turned away and wailed— again, he just did not want a shirt on! Finally, I said “RJ! You don’t WANT your shirt! You don’t like shirts! Shirts are yucky!” He started to calm down, and I continued: “You don’t WANT a shirt! No shirt! No shirt!” He started to soften and he let me put his shirt on as I continued: “I know you don’t LIKE your shirt, you don’t want it, but we need to put a shirt on if we want to go downstairs and play! Do you want to go downstairs and play?”
So, after all that, we’re realizing that RJ just wants us to acknowledge his emotions. I think that most of his tantrums come from the frustration that we don’t understand how he feels, and possibly that we just don’t care how he feels; we’re just forcing him to do whatever WE want him to do. So when we acknowledge and identify his emotions, I think he starts to trust that we DO know how he feels, and more importantly, that we CARE how he feels. So far this has been able to calm him down enough to at least move on to the next step.
Charlie used to object to changing his clothes in the exact same way! Sometimes we would be late for daycare because he would object when we tried to dress him in the morning. But after reading Tina’s post, we started acknowledging his emotions, and it has definitely helped. Now “Tina’s No” is an important part of our parenting toolkit.
Tina’s No is not quite a full no… but we’ve found that after we acknowledge Charlie’s emotions, he is much more open to agreeing to things. Thanks, Tina!
2. The Hide & Seek No
On Friday, Mrs. Hide & Seek posted a tip which rocked Mrs. Bee and my world:
I am pretty strict when it comes to my daughter learning to wait and sitting nicely when we’re out to eat. I just insist on it and don’t accept anything else.
If she acts up, then I say “when you behave like this, we have to leave.” And off we go. She learned very quickly that her negative behaviors have consequences. Now, she sits nicely and we love going to eat as a family.
As for learning to wait, we prevent tantrums and issues by using what I’ve dubbed the “first-then” approach. When I’m feeding the newborn and my daughter asks for something that I can’t do at the moment, I’ll say “OK! We can do that! FIRST I have to finish feeding the baby, THEN we can do (X).” Then, I have her repeat me and I’ll ask “What do we do FIRST?” And she answers me…and then she gets lots of praise. She then will play on her own for the rest of the time.
Sometimes I’ll remind her of what we’re doing next by saying, for example “Honey! I’m so excited to get you your chocolate milk when the baby is done eating! It will be pretty soon!” She seems to like that I haven’t forgotten her wishes and that she’s still at the top of my mind. This helps her wait without fuss.
We tried out Hide & Seek’s tip this weekend, and it worked so well! Mrs. Hide & Seek – if your ears were burning this weekend, it was because Mrs. Bee and I were praising your name to the heavens.
Here’s an example of how we used the Hide & Seek No. Bee and I took Charlie and Olive to the grocery store yesterday. As usual, Charlie started begging us to eat the various treats we put into the cart. We said “no”, but he kept begging (maybe our no wasn’t authoritative and French enough?). So we tried a Hide & Seek No using a When/Then construct (we didn’t remember her suggested verbiage quite right).
The Bee Parents: “Charlie, WHEN we pay for the food, THEN you can eat the cupcakes. But we have to pay for the food first, okay?”
Charlie: (with a sad but accepting tone of voice) “Okay.”
We were thrilled and a bit shocked by how quick and effective the Hide & Seek No was! We used it over and over at the grocery store, and Charlie accepted it every time. So it’s time for a big ol’ public THANK YOU from the Bee family to Mrs. Hide & Seek!
THANK YOU!!!
3. The French No
We read Pamela Druckerman’s WSJ article on how to “saying non with authority.” Here was the key excerpt:
[My friend] Frédérique … said that I needed to make my “no” stronger and to really believe in it. The next time Leo tried to run outside the gate, I said “no” more sharply than usual. He left anyway. I followed and dragged him back. “You see?” I said. “It’s not possible.”
Frédérique smiled again and told me not to shout but rather to speak with more conviction. I was scared that I would terrify him. “Don’t worry,” Frederique said, urging me on.
Leo didn’t listen the next time either. But I gradually felt my “nos” coming from a more convincing place. They weren’t louder, but they were more self-assured. By the fourth try, when I was finally brimming with conviction, Leo approached the gate but—miraculously—didn’t open it. He looked back and eyed me warily. I widened my eyes and tried to look disapproving.
After about 10 minutes, Leo stopped trying to leave altogether. He seemed to forget about the gate and just played in the sandbox with the other kids. Soon Frédérique and I were chatting, with our legs stretched out in front of us. I was shocked that Leo suddenly viewed me as an authority figure.
We’ve actually had mixed results with using a French No. It’s been very helpful to remember “speak with more conviction” when we say no to Charlie. We’ve been doing that, and he has definitely been realizing that “no means no.”
But we’ve found that the French No is not always successful for us. It’s a valuable tool, but it works best when we have other “Nos” we can draw upon. For example, at the grocery store, we could’ve spent the whole shopping experience throwing authoritative French Nos at Charlie every time he begged for cupcakes. But instead, we used the Hide & Seek No, and we resolved the whole situation instantly. Or when we dress Charlie for school, we could ignore his objections and throw a French No at him. Or we could use a Tina No, and he calms down almost instantly.
What we’ve found is that the French No is a powerful tool, but it’s something you want to save for when you really need it. When the other Nos fail us, the French No is there just waiting to be used. For example, last night Charlie started acting crazy while I was feeding him dinner. (He woke up at 5:30 am, and had been a bit off all day.) So when I stepped away from his high chair to get him a drink, I guess I shouldn’t have been surprised when he started grabbing handfuls of his food and throwing it on the floor. (He hasn’t really done this before to me though, so I was surprised.)
This was a situation that called for a French No, and so I broke it out with authority. Charlie knew right away I meant business. He started acting all confused and saying over and over, “What is Charlie doing? What is Charlie doing?” It was so cute, but I didn’t crack a smile (I was channeling Frédérique and her French Nos). Instead I looked at his hand, which was holding some seaweed that he was just about to throw on the ground. I said firmly, “Charlie, No! Do you want a Timeout?”
Charlie said, “No Daddy,” and he put the seaweed down. Victory!!!
Many thanks to Tina, Mrs. Hide & Seek and Pamela Druckerman for teaching us three ways to say no! Bee and I are determined not to spoil Charlie, and to make sure that our kids are not entitled. Armed with three forms of no (and timeouts too), we feel like we have a fighting chance.
Thanks to the Hellobee blogging and boards communities for all of your help!
How do you say no to your kids?
Toddler Tantrums part 4 of 12
1. How to prevent tantrums: A guide to the 5 triggers and 2 stressors that cause tantrums by Mr. Bee2. The Power of Timeouts by Mr. Bee
3. The Case Against Timeouts by Mr. Bee
4. Three Ways to say "no" to your kids by Mr. Bee
5. From Devil to Angel: "Tina's No" by mrs. wagon
6. What Shamu Taught Me About Happy Toddlers by Mr. Bee
7. The Best Parenting Book I've Ever Read by Mr. Bee
8. Cracking the code on toddler tantrums by Mrs. Jacks
9. What would Ellie do? Managing tantrums. by Mrs. Jacks
10. The Trenches of Toddler-Dom by Mrs. High Heels
11. The Nurtured Heart Approach: Disciplining for Greatness by Mrs. Twine
12. Diagnosing Tantrums and Behavioral Problems for 3-4 Year Olds by Mrs. Bee
GOLD / apricot / 337 posts
I love this post! Thanks for the great tips. LM is beginning to test boundaries a little– more so because she is exploring her environment a lot more and is a lot more mobile. She likes to jiggle the baby gate and resist sitting still in her high chair while eating, so we need to start saying “no” more often. I feel that Papa Marbles and I are a lot more committed to saying “no” whereas grandma almost always immediately gives in the minute LM starts to whine. We’ll definitely have to try a few of these as LM gets older!
hostess / eggplant / 11068 posts
Wow~! Just reading this post makes me want to try these all out! LO is 6.5 months so I have a ways to go
In the video, when Mrs. Bee says, “Do you want gummy bears?” I love how Charlie actually had to think about it. But no, he wanted ice cream.
GOLD / wonderful coffee bean / 18478 posts
I find that Tina’s No doesn’t work on my daughter. (Sorry Tina, good tip though!)
Mrs. H&S No is pretty effective. I have been doing this a lot in the last few weeks and I have been able to get her to do a lot more things. This is my favorite tactic … because it works on my daughter!
As far as the French No, I usually draw on that when there is a safety concern. I am careful not to over use the word No because I don’t want it to become meaningless so I reserve its use for the most serious situations. Like “NO, you cannot run in the parking lot”. Otherwise, I try to find some other way of telling her things without saying No. If she throws her food on the floor, I will say “Food belongs on your tray or in your mouth but not on the floor”. This is the type of language they use at daycare as they don’t want to always say No, No, No a million times a day.
grapefruit / 4800 posts
Thanks for this post. I’ll have to keep acknowledging emotions and 1st, then in mind. Right now my LO is a bit too young for verbal explanations (8 -1/2 months) so when I say no to her playing with a cord I try to replace it with something she can play with, But also have a sharper no for when she starts trying to get off the socket covers and move her away. But I think we still have a bit to go before she understands the no.
grape / 75 posts
great post! much appreciated!!!
GOLD / pomelo / 5167 posts
I wish I could favorite a post so that it doesn’t get lost. I need to have this access at all times. So I dont forget! Can’t wait to try the WHEN/THEN and acknowledging Mavricks feelings.
I need to try the Tina routine when its time to change Mavricks diaper. I tell him, “before getting out of the crib, we need to change your diaper… okay?” he says “no (while nodding his head”) i just wonder if hes big enough to understand that diaper change isnt fun but once we do it …. then it means we can play.
admin / watermelon / 14210 posts
@blushink: i’m having a button designed so posts without pictures can be pinned. but you can actually pin a video too — not that this video teaches you anything.
GOLD / pomelo / 5167 posts
@Mrs. Bee: Ah yes! I didnt think of pinning it… but maybe a future feature on HB? I would love to favor some of my to-go posts.
admin / watermelon / 14210 posts
@blushink: yes def we must build it.
blogger / pomegranate / 3201 posts
Great tips! I have to admit, though, throwing food on the floor might be abad habit for us to break, as we have two dogs who will gladly eat anything that lands on the floor. I could definitely see us getting lazy about that one, especially if we don’t really have to clean up the food because the pups will take care of it for us.
olive / 61 posts
whattt? that video of charlie is so cute! that’s nothing compared to avery’s tantrums and i found myself wondering if terrible twos can start at 13 months. when she wants something, like a yogurt drop or a gummy bear, or her milk, and she doesn’t want to wait and will start screaming, crying, and tossing her head back and even sometimes swinging her fists about! i feel like she’s too young to be disciplined so i’m kind of stuff.
however, she does understand no, and she does understand “one more, ok?” and usually when i dont want to give it to her and i give her a firm no, she will cry but then accept it after a few minutes because i absolutely refuse to give in. but when she’s waiting for her milk to warm up she will freak and throw a tantrum, and i can’t figure out how to make her be patient when waiting for something! i just ignore her cries and take my time making her bottle so she understands that her screaming wont make me give it to her faster….
admin / watermelon / 14210 posts
@AQL1211: that’s not really a tantrum — he’s just whining a little bit there. Real tantrums involve tears, and Charlie definitely throws them!
pomegranate / 3503 posts
We use Mrs H&S’s no tactic as well. Once we get him to acknowledge something, he’s usually pretty good about following through with it. In times when he continues to ask and whine for things after he’s acknowledged that he will get it later (eg cookies only after dinner), then we just do a firm “No” and walk away.
Am really enjoying all of yours and mrs bee’s toddler behavior posts.
blogger / pineapple / 12381 posts
I love that you pulled in suggestion from Hellobees! We’ve had some moderate success with toddlerease and the fast food rule. (Though not all the time and you feel silly doing it!)
pomegranate / 3053 posts
So funny with the back and forth! I can’t see Charlie throwing a tantrum but I can believe it being that I have a son too.
We just tell my son that we don’t have any more of what he wants and he eventually believes us. Hahaha! Other times we get down to his level and tell him that he can have that as long as he finishes his bfast/lunch/dinner first. It gets him excited to finish his meal….but doesn’t always work.
We also use distraction to get him to think about something else he likes which usually gets him to stop wanting something so badly. For example, when it was time for his nap today he kept saying “no.” And then he wanted to “lie” in our bed first so we did that. Then I thought of something he’s been into these days – this Scooby Doo book that my he and my husband has been reading. I asked him if he wanted to read that book and he said, “yes,” and that’s how I got him to go to his room to read a book and then nap. We just have to be creative.
honeydew / 7968 posts
thanks for the tips! will definitely try them when it comes time!
hostess / wonderful apple seed / 16729 posts
Great post! I, too, was trying to figure out to remember this post. I just pinned it on pinterest! I pinned the video. I wish there was a pic of the title I could post. Anyway, I described the pin, so it is now saved!
admin / wonderful grape / 20724 posts
@bluestriped bee: For blog posts without any pictures (like this one), Mrs. Bee is going to be adding a pic of the post title, so that it’s easier to pin!
hostess / wonderful apple seed / 16729 posts
@mrbee: Oh, cool!
blogger / wonderful cherry / 21628 posts
I love the video. Cute!
blogger / watermelon / 14218 posts
haha… thanks for the shoutout! I feel so honored that you have named a No after me. I love that my name is associated with “no”… haha. I swear I’m not THAT mean of a mommy…
tantrums… tears, and RJ does the whole arching of the back thing that actually gets pretty dangerous when we’re on the stairs or outside standing on pavement. blech.
We went away this weekend and RJ has been acting out ever since we got back. I think it’s definitely time to try a few more Nos because the Tina No is not working a lot of the time. The Hide and Seek no unfortunately doesn’t work for us… I don’t think he understands the first then concept yet. We do it a lot but it doesn’t do much for us. The French No definitely doesn’t work while we’re mid-tantrum because RJ is so sensitive, as soon as we start to get firm with him he just breaks down crying and then it just turns into sadness and comfort, and as soon as he feels better he continues to misbehave. It’s almost like he’s manipulating us into comforting him so he can get back to asking for what he wants!!! These kids….
persimmon / 1255 posts
I pinned this post too! We use the Tina NO to a limited extent since LO is still young to understand feelings and just started using the first/then concept to some success. I’ve been using the French NO specifically things that are non-negotiable (like biting on the remotes).
I also employ a sing-songy “No, no, no” for teaching moments or for small offenses. For example, “No, no, no, don’t eat that rock, it’s yucky.”
cherry / 116 posts
Such a cute video! Hope I remember the different types of nos when our lo is older.
GOLD / apricot / 341 posts
Thank you for this post! We are just getting into temper tantrum territory and I am finding it to be the most challenging part of my 14-month experience as a mother so far… Little A might be a little young for these techniques, but I am definitely going to give them a try!
cherry / 128 posts
@AQL1211 – babies/children don’t understand the concept of time, – they really live in the present. (I actually think it’s funny that as adults we are always trying to live in the present and enjoy the moment but have a tough time doing so and then we spend all this energy trying to train our kids from living in the moment.) So you can try describing the process and acknowledging her feelings as you’re making the milk, because 1) you are giving her words (and a more appropriate way) to express her emotions, and 2) as you describe what you’re doing she’ll begin to understand the process.
Thanks for sharing Mr. Bee! We use all of the types of “no’s” you mentioned, using mostly the first and the second. Another way to approach the “no” is to think of answering “yes” – what can you answer “yes” to? Can you say “yes” I acknowledge and can name your feelings? Can you say “yes” to the request, but at a different time? e.g. “yes, swimming suits are so fun and free! yes we will wear your swimming suit after school today. Now we have to go get dressed and go to school.”
We only use the 3rd “no” for serious issues of safety, so that “no” means “no.”
Kathryn Kvols has a great list of different ways to say “no” – http://www.incaf.com/images/wisdom/8.jpg
I highly recommend her book, “Redirecting Children’s Behavior.” It’s very short and easy to read. It might be out of print, but it’s easy to find a used copy.
Finally, here’s a short excerpt from a Montessori newsletter that I thought you might be interested in, on time-outs:
“When a “time out” is necessary because nothing else is working, be sure to treat the child as you would like to be treated. For example you are at a party with friends and you are exhausted and tired and hungry and you lose it and say something rude to your spouse. How do you want him or her to treat you?
Would you prefer “Get out of this room immediately!” or perhaps “Say you are sorry and say it like you mean it!” Or “Could I please speak to you in private for a moment” and then “Something must be very wrong for you to get this upset, shall we go home so you can rest?”
When a child needs time out he should have already seen adults cherish private time or time alone (time out) to recover or perhaps to rest or work. Then this experience can be offered to the child in the same spirit and not as punishment.”
source: http://www.michaelolaf.net/newsaugust2010.html
cherry / 128 posts
@Mini Piccolini: I don’t think it’s ever too young to start. I’m glad I started practicing different ways of saying “no” without using the word “no” (so often “no” is one of the first words children say because that is the word they hear most often.”) early on because *I* needed the time and practice to re-program myself. Also, by starting when they are young, you are giving your child a vocabulary to identify and express what they are feeling.
admin / wonderful grape / 20724 posts
@AQL1211: We made the mistake of not being as strict with Charlie when he was young and when he wasn’t feeling well. In retrospect, I wish I had been stricter with him from an earlier age!
By the time we cracked down, Charlie was already more spoiled/entitled than I would have liked… I wish we had set more limits earlier. I know what you mean about not wanting to discipline too young though!
admin / wonderful grape / 20724 posts
@blushink: You can favorite blog posts now.
GOLD / pomelo / 5167 posts
@mrbee: awesome!!!
pea / 22 posts
I need to figure out how to utilize no’s for my 8 month old. He’s too young to understand acknowledging his feelings. Usually a stern “Christian, No.” will do…and he will pause and sit. I am surprised at well he listens, although i would like to utilize something else. I don’t want no’s to creep into his vocab too early.
cherry / 128 posts
@Dece – as I posted in my comment above, check out Kathryn Kvols’ great list of different ways to say “no” – http://www.incaf.com/images/wisdom/8.jpg
I highly recommend her book, “Redirecting Children’s Behavior.” It’s very short and easy to read. It might be out of print, but it’s easy to find a used copy.
guest
I have to say, I think the “misbehavior” in the video is Charlie’s frustration. You didn’t acknowledge his request for ice cream at all — you just kept giving him other options. If I were asking for something specific and someone kept offering me other things, I’d be frustrated and break down, too. (Heck, it’s how I felt when I was buying my car!)
I think it’s vital to address your toddler’s request clearly before moving on. If my daughter asks for chocolate or a cookie before a meal, I remind her “No chocolate until we eat regular food. Desserts are for after the meal!” That way, her request is acknowledged. It’s sort of a Tina’s No.
Now, if they are still whiny after the acknowledgement, then you have to move on to time outs or other discipline. But I have been very lucky and my daughter listens well… when I listen to her.
admin / wonderful grape / 20724 posts
Hey Surin – great point! I explored some similar ideas from the book “How to Talk So Kids Will Listen & Listen So Kids Will Talk.” in a later blog post:
http://www.hellobee.com/2012/06/26/the-best-parenting-book-ive-ever-read/