Recently there have been several boards threads on when a baby can be sleep trained. There doesn’t seem to be a consensus among doctors, sleep experts, and parents. I’ve done so much reading on the topic, I can’t believe I only recently remembered the book Bed Timing by husband and wife developmental therapists, Marc Lewis and Isabella Granic. Lewis and Granic suggest that it doesn’t really matter how you sleep train, as all of the popular methods work. What matters most is when you do it. Children go through predictable developmental stages at certain ages (another great book to read on that is The Wonder Weeks), so timing sleep training around those stages ensures the least tears and most success.
The first good opportunity for sleep training is between 2½ and four months, they feel. “This is a period of relative stability and resilience,” the authors write. “There is no good reason not to try sleep training at this age if your intuition says ‘go.’ ” When babies are four to 5½ months is not a good time because “at four months, there’s a lot more smiling, giggling, and tickling games are starting to work,” said Lewis. “As your baby learns new interpersonal skills—skills that call for expected responses from you and lead to a stronger bond between you—it’s better not to disturb them until they’ve really begun to solidify.”
This really made a lot of sense to me! Many babies go through an infamous “4 month sleep regression,” and Charlie was no exception. While his sleep was already bad before 4 months, it became exponentially worse after 4 months! Babies are going through an intense developmental stage at that time, becoming more social, and mastering skills like rolling over. We sleep trained Charlie at 4 1/2 months using the Ferber method when his quality of life had greatly declined due to exhaustion. Looking back now, I think we probably should have sleep trained him closer to 3 months. He was a big boy (90%), took to sleep training very well despite mastering rolling over in the middle of it, and we could have saved him weeks of exhaustion.
Personally, Granic and Lewis chose to Ferberize their sons at six months. The couple believe that at 5½ to 7½ months, “babies are engaged with the world of objects around them [more than they are with people] and show almost no sign of separation distress.” It’s an ideal time to sleep train, they say. (source)
Because sleep training worked so well with Charlie, I always thought that we’d sleep train our second child. Olive is nowhere close to sleeping through the night (she wakes up 4 times during a 14 hour period), and her naps are usually 30 minutes or less, but she’s happy, is getting enough sleep in a 24 hour period, and I’m just used to being sleep deprived as a second time parent. Olive is 5 1/2 months old now, and if we do decide to sleep train, it’ll probably be within the next 2 months since 8-11 months is supposed to be when separation anxiety really kicks in, and sleep training becomes difficult.
Charlie left and Olive right. Wow Charlie was so much chubbier than Olive!
These are their recommended ages for good and not so good times to sleep train:
0 to 2.5 months – not so good
2.5 to 4 months – good
4 to 5.5 months – not so good
5.5 to 7.5 months – ideal
8 to11 months – really not so good
12 to 16 months – good
17 to 21 months – not so good
22 to 27 months – good
28 months to 3 years – not so good
3 to 3.5 years – good
3.5 to 4 years – not so good
For those of you trying to decide which sleep training book to read, this may be a good one to start with because they list the pros and cons of the 5 most popular sleep training methods, including Mindell, Ferber and Weissbluth. If method doesn’t really matter, then you just have to find one that you feel comfortable with, and be consistent.
If you sleep trained, do you feel you should have done it sooner or later?
Sleep Training part 2 of 11
1. Sleep Training Books by Guides2. When to Sleep Train by Mrs. Bee
3. Does When You Sleep Train Help Determine Success? by Mrs. Bee
4. Sleep Training Noelle: Part I by Mrs. High Heels
5. Sleep Training Noelle: Part II by Mrs. High Heels
6. Rubies' Sleep Training Story by parenting
7. Sleep Training Part 1 - How We Night Trained by Mrs. Bee
8. Sleep Training by Mrs. Jump Rope
9. The Whens, Whys and Hows of Our Sleep Training Process by Mrs. Pen
10. Sleep at 8 months & How Baby H Started Sleeping Through the Night at 12 Weeks by Mrs. Hopscotch
11. Crying it Out by Mrs. Pencil
GOLD / wonderful coffee bean / 18478 posts
Thanks for the good/not good times. That is really interesting! Can I assume this timeline applies to nap training as well?
Luckily, we didn’t have to sleep train for nights. I think my daughter could have benefited from nap training but we’re not home very much so we never have focused on it.
GOLD / pomelo / 5167 posts
We did the same. Sleep trained at 4.5 months. I would of done it earlier too. Mavi was a big boy too.
hostess / wonderful honeydew / 32460 posts
I’m definitely sleep training #2.. I can’t do what I’m doing when I have a toddler to look after too. Thanks for doing all the research for me!
blogger / wonderful cherry / 21616 posts
this is super helpful! I have a one month old right now and my new-mom adrenaline for the first four weeks is starting to wear off and i’m feeling the effects of sleeplessness. I’m just starting to read up on sleep-training for once he hits the 11 lb mark (that’s when my midwife said he can sleep through the night and I can eliminate night feedings if I wish). I will be checking out that book – thanks! I’m happy to hear about one that talks about several different methods.
persimmon / 1255 posts
I wanted to sleep-train my LO @ 3 months cause it seemed like she was slightly aware of her surroundings and was ready but my doctor said to wait ’til she was 4 months old, which in hindsight, was a little too late. By 4 months, she was fully aware of her surroundings and knew where she didn’t want to be……in the crib.
If we do need to sleep-train next time, I think I’ll start @ 3 months.
GOLD / wonderful apricot / 22646 posts
Bookmarking for the future!! So helpful!!
GOLD / apricot / 341 posts
Our little one has always had good night sleep (waking only once per night since around 6 wks old, and then sleeping from 6ish to 6ish from 9 months old). But naps were a complete nightmare from 6 wks to around 7.5 months when we did sleep train. We were recommended sleep training at 3-4 months but didn’t feel really comfortable with it until later. I’m so glad we waited. At 7.5 months, it felt ok to do it and it only really took a day or two.
We used a combo of Ferber and the Pantley no-cry methods. So basically we let him cry but only really ever for 3-4 minutes at a time and if it ever felt not ok, we just scrapped it and tried again at the next nap. For us, Pantley’s permission to go with your gut even at the expense of consistency made all the difference.
blogger / wonderful cherry / 21616 posts
@Mini Piccolini: what book uses the “Pantley” method? I’ve ever heard of it but I like what you said about it allowing you to go with your gut. That is the mainproblen I have had with CIO methods, I can’t bear to hear my baby cry and my instinct is to comfort my child because I believe his cries mean something to me. Once he’s older I’m sure not all his cried will be as need-based as they are now at 1 month old so it might be easier. Anyway, I really like the sounds of how you did it. What books did you use then?
GOLD / apricot / 341 posts
@miss-spunkin: Elizabeth Pantley authored the “no-cry” books. There is a No-Cry Sleep Solution and a No-Cry Nap Solution. She is very against CIO and really “backed-up” our gut feeling (at 3-4 months) that CIO was not right for us. The Nap Solution is great because it has a wider range of methods to try, and we found them helpful in improving naps.
I will admit that it is not until we did eventually do a modified CIO (we left our little one alone in his crib to cry for around 3 minutes at a time, then went in and comforted and left again) that our son started to take good long(er) naps. But Pantley’s philosophy of quitting what you’re doing if either baby or parent gets upset, and following what feels right even if it means you forgo consistency from time to time, has made us feel ok about sleep training.
Even now, at 15 months old, we stick to our gut feeling when things get tricky. Most sleep methods advocate total maintenance of sleep routines even when children are sick etc, because letting routines go in those situations means letting routines go. For us, we just feel better about being more lenient when it feels right to be, and then we try to get back on track once everyone is back to normal. Like now, our son has a cold and screams when we leave the room at bedtime (normally we just say night night and leave him to fall asleep on his own), so we sit by the door until he falls asleep. Yes, it will take an evening or two of 2-3 CIO rounds (still only 3ish minutes each) to get things back once he is healthy again, but that just feels better to us than maintaining a routine which clearly isn’t working for him while he’s unwell…
GOLD / wonderful grape / 20289 posts
Uh oh…. we’re in the “really not so good” age. We don’t want to sleep train anyway, but now I don’t feel like I could even if I wanted to.
honeydew / 7917 posts
I wish I had done more research when I was pregnant. I didn’t feel at all prepared after my LO was born, and sleep training was often a battle. If I could do it all over again, I would start earlier at 3 months.
olive / 55 posts
Woo hoo, we hit the nail on the head — my LO turned 7 months on 3/19, and we started sleep training just a few days before that. Nights = perfect, but naps are still a total challenge for him (sigh).
wonderful pear / 26210 posts
We had to sleep train three times before it actually worked. He was way too young at 4 months and because he was swaddled, he couldn’t self soothe. His moro reflex at the time was too strong and the swaddling was necessary.
Second time was at 6 months after he started breaking out of the swaddle, he was too active at the time and we just sucked it up.
Third time was just after 8 months, and it worked. Yes, it was the time of separation anxiety, but it didn’t seem to affect the sleep training.
We did Ferber’s CIO method each time.
guest
I saved this post when it was first written and my LO was only a month old. I’ve read it over and over again! He used to be a great night sleeper going down without a peep and waking up for 1-2 feeds throughout the night then going down without a peep again. For the past 2 weeks he has been all over the place and nightwakings are much more frequent, and frankly, taking a toll on our sanity!
With the 3-month mark approaching I know we are anxious to sleep train but I wanted to ask about Charlie’s temperament as a baby since you said he would’ve responded well with STing earlier as i know temperament plays a large part in one’s response to STing.
FTR, our LO was in the 75th percentile at 2 months and is double is birthweight.
admin / watermelon / 14210 posts
@sam – i think charlie was an average baby. he wasn’t difficult, but he wasn’t as mellow as some super mellow babies that i know. he was an ok sleeper the first two months, and then it got so much worse. the same thing is probably happening with your son who is becoming much more aware of his surroundings.
you can check out more of my sleep training posts here:
http://www.hellobee.com/2011/09/23/sleep-training-part-1-how-we-night-trained/
http://www.hellobee.com/2011/09/27/nap-training/
guest
Thanks @mrs.bee. Does that mean you endured 2 months of progressively worse night sleep with Charlie?!? I don’t think I could handle that!
I will definitely be referring to your nap and sleep training posts over the next few weeks. DS is an ok night sleeper but we can already see how the over tiredness is affecting him. I do have a question about when you chose to give Charlie a bottle as it ranges from 4-9 hours since he is initially in his crib. Did you set a minimum time based on how long he was able to consistently go between feeds before his sleep went awry?
admin / watermelon / 14210 posts
@sam – if you register for an account, you will get an email when i respond (in case you have any other questions, as i can’t always respond to comments right away).
from months 2 – 4 1/2, his sleep got worse and worse until we felt like we had no choice but to sleep train.
when he was a baby, we fed him if it had been 3 hours since his last feed when he woke up at night. the other times we rocked him back to sleep. when we were sleep training, we kept one middle of the night feeding and cried out the rest of the feedings.
hope that helps! we’re getting ready to sleep train olive soon!
pomegranate / 3383 posts
Thanks @mrsbee! I just registered :).
I guess my question is when did you know Charlie was just having a nightwaking rather than needing a bottle since the times vary between bedtime and feeding in your sleep training post. Lately I have been offering my LO a pacifier if he wakes; if he takes it he’s not hungry and it buys me at least an hour. I would hate to be starting another bad habit though (although he doesn’t need the paci to go to sleep).
Looking forward to hearing how STing goes with Olive! Good luck!
admin / watermelon / 14210 posts
@Sammyfab: waking up in the middle of the night for a feeding beyond a certain age is really just a habit. they wake up hungry because their bodies are used to being fed at that time.
you can try gradually night weaning. do you give a bottle? you can try reducing the amount of milk by a little bit each night, or adding increasing amounts of water.
we kept one middle of the night feeding, but he dropped it pretty quickly on his own after sleep training. pre sleep training he was getting 4 middle of the night bottles!
guest
I find myself at the 8 month mark. My baby refuses to sleep, no/little naps during the day. What do I do?
guest
Hi,
I am really stuck, my son used to self soothe. Then at 7.5 months he got really fuss. I read about this book and now he does not sleep naps much and it is battle to get him to bed, hour of holding and patting, then only when he wants to i.e. around 10 at night. I am tired. He is just transitioning to solids, a bit latter (started at 7 months). I am really not sure what to do. Some advice please…
i.e how much crying is too much?
guest
I rocked my son to sleep for the first 3 months. Then I used the Hold With Love method by Susan Urban from her guide about teaching a baby to fall asleep alone ( http://www.parental-love.com ). I am so glad I did it. My son is well rested (no more rocking or waking up at night to breastfeed to make him fall asleep again), I am well rested, my husband is well rested! So since my boy turned 3 months we are much happier family
guest
After reading Tina’s post and searching the internet I saw a lot of people talking about Susan Urban and her guide about teaching a baby to fall asleep alone and I decided to get it and follow the instructions. Now I am so glad I did it because it has been a great helpl. No harm for a baby and very fast. The guide is very short so I didn’t waste my time. I can really recommend it
guest
Urban’s guide – really helpful, can recommend it to everybody. Helped me a lot!
guest
I used Hold With Love method by Susan Urban one too! I really loved the way that Susan is writing – like a mother, not a sleeping-professor. And being a step-by-step guide really is very helpful! I tried this method because I knew I couldn’t do anything involving Cry it out. It worked well for me in just 3 night, and it is Olive’s 4th month. Now we are going to start working on extending our naps.